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Square Foot Cost vs. House Size


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By Joe in Duluth, MN on 9/28/2009


I would like to start out by saying that I am new to this site and new to owner-building (I have read the book). We are looking to build a new home in about 2 - 3 years and planning to spend $400K without land. Some of the details we would like in the home are ICF basement, quality windows, custom cabinetry and built-ins, energy efficient, and at least 2,800 sq feet above the basement (two-story preferred). I plan to have the basement roughed in so I can finish at a later date for some extra sweat equity.

My wife and I are currently going through floor plans and gathering ideas of what we would like in the home and I am having trouble figuring out how large of a house we can build. My question is in regards to home size vs. sq foot costs. I know that as you increase the size of a home, the per sq foot cost goes down. Does anyone have any idea what that ratio looks like? If I have a 2,500 sq ft home does a 5,000 sq ft home cost 80% more?

I realize it is a difficult question to answer but I am just looking for a good "rule of thumb" for estimating this. I am way too early in my planning to start asking for bids.


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By Jeff in Hartland, WI on 9/28/2009


Hi Joe,

Costs will vary considerably in different areas of the country. Even in one region (like the upper Midwest), you'll find quite a bit of variation. I can say that you could build a 2,800 sq ft house in the Milwaukee area for your budget. But that doesn't necessarily mean you could build it in Minneapolis for that price.

One option that might work is to visit a couple of local builders. Pick a plan that's close to what you want to build--similar square footage, similar construction; with as many of the features you want in the house as possible. Get them to give you a ballpark estimate. Some may cooperate. Some may not. You can even visit a few builder open houses and do your own average square footage cost calculations from their models. Generally, a builder-built house will cost quite a bit more than one where you act as your own contractor. So if you could afford a builder-built house that has the size and features you want, you can definitely afford to build your own.

Jeff

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By Joe in Duluth, MN on 9/28/2009


I have spoken with one builder who recently built a 3,750 sq ft house with the features I am looking for. He said he could build me the same one for about $550K (no lot). Do you think it’s possible to get it done as an O-B for less then $400K? He also told me that most of his custom homes are no more than $140/sq foot in cost.


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By David in Greenville, SC on 9/28/2009


Hey Joe,

I wish I could tell you a down and dirty way to estimate this but, there just really isn't one. There are simply too many variables involved. For instance, in your original post you stated you knew you wanted an ICF foundation and at least 2,800 sq ft above grade. However, you hadn't decided on a floor plan yet. Well, if you settled on roughly 2,800 sq ft and built a salt box style home where approximately half the square footage is on the first floor and half on the second, your basement would have to be 1,400 sq ft. However, if you decided on a plan that had, let's say, 2,100 sq ft down and 700 up, then your basement would have to be 2,100 square feet. A significant increase in cost, and that is just one major variable among hundreds. Yes, I read your post and what you are asking but, again, the reality is you can make raw square footage as cheap as the basic building materials plus labor. Maybe $40 a foot, or, you can specify features that push costs to exceed $300 a foot.

Unfortunately, until you have at least a solid floor plan in place, any pricing will just be a shot in the dark. While judging prices based on what you see in builders’ models can be helpful, these homes are rarely representative of high-end construction despite what their prices might lead you to believe. Ask the $140 a foot guy if that price includes ICF foundations. I would be surprised if it did. The point is, in order for you to get an idea of the cost of your home, you have to be more specific about what you want in your home. The best place to start is by deciding exactly what you NEED. Then add in what you want and can't live without. Figure room sizes to accommodate how they will really be used and then put it all together and see what you've got.

Maybe you find out that 2,300 sq ft works perfectly. Maybe it takes 3,100 sq ft. Don't be afraid to throw in every whim on the first draft. You can whittle it down from there. When you think you've got the plan that meets your needs and satisfies your most desired wants, then start pricing things. You may have to whittle a little more! Or, you may find you can add some things you thought you'd have to do without. The point is you have a very sufficient budget to build a wonderful and desirable home and you have the time to plan it out to take best advantage of every dollar. Remember square footage in and of itself doesn't make a great home. A certain amount of money spent doesn't make a great home. Great Ideas, Great Planning, and Great People are what really make a great home.


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By Jeff in Hartland, WI on 9/28/2009


Hi Joe, 


It might be possible, but maybe not using high-end materials. I got bids on a similar-sized house from three builders. The cheapest was $135/sq ft, most expensive was $182/sq ft. I brought it in for about $121/sq ft. which was a little bit higher than my goal (and my budget). But the end result was definitely closer to the finish level I would have expected from the builder with the highest bid. So one way to look at it is that we completed the project about 33% cheaper than the builder would have. 

We just got the house re-appraised. It came in about 3% higher than the original plan appraisal, with a final value of $167/sq ft. So we built it for about 25% less than the appraised value. I'm sure glad I didn't go with the high bid. 

We were able to keep the budget down by doing a lot of the work ourselves. We installed the structured wiring and audio system, installed and finished the wood floors, milled the trim work, did most of the finish carpentry, laid about half of the tile, and painted and stained--both interior and exterior. We picked those trades because they were some of the more labor-intensive tasks on the project. I'd guess that about 20% of our savings was from managing the project ourselves--the remaining 80% from the work we did ourselves. 

We didn't use any "builder-grade" materials. So our price came in about 10% or 15% higher than it could have. The moral of the story is that you can either build a bigger builder-grade house, or a smaller house with higher-quality features. But either way, you can do it a lot cheaper yourself than you could with a builder. 

Again, your mileage may vary. You might be much better at shopping than we were. Materials may be cheaper or more expensive since it's now a year later and you're in a different area. You may choose to do more or less of the work yourself. But getting a square foot estimate from local builders will at least get you in the ballpark, and let you start selecting or designing a plan. 

Jeff

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By Kenneth in Lees Summit, MO on 9/30/2009


Why limit your ICF to basement only?
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By Grant in Blacksburg, VA on 9/30/2009


As I understand it, the cost of ICF on basement walls, as compared to concrete wall construction is a modest premium for a large benefit. However, the cost of replacing wooden walls with ICF walls "above ground" starts being a much higher premium. Yes, the benefit is worth it in life-cycle and monthly O&M (operation and maintenance) cost savings "IF" you can get your mortgage appraisal approved for the construction costs, and "IF" you can get approved for the mortgage. I believe in most cases, the lower O&M costs will not prevent a homeowner from "affording" the higher cost ICF walls, and may in fact prove cash flow positive for the homeowner on a monthly cash outlay basis.

So the "big" issue, is can you get approved for the larger mortgage it takes to build with ICF. A "not so big" house made with ICF would likely be superior in every way to a larger non-ICF house of the same construction costs, BUT that is a tough decision for most families to make. Space often equates to sanity in larger families <grin>.  Space also tends to carry more weight in appraisal values, resale values, and ultimate equity gains for the homeowner.


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By Joe in Duluth, MN on 9/30/2009


I would prefer to build a two-story home with basement (three floors total). I don't think full ICF is the way to go for this design. My original question had more to do with how sq footage affects the cost per sq foot.


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By Grant in Blacksburg, VA on 9/30/2009


Joe,

When it comes to cost-estimating $/sq ft, rules of thumb are dangerous.  I don't know that anyone can give you an exact answer.  But I hate reading questions "I" can't answer, because then I know I have a blind spot, myself, that may bite me in the butt when I get started on my project.  So I can't help but look for answers to such questions <grin>.

It's not necessarily the "size increase" that lowers the cost per sq ft the most dramatically.  Yes, if you are building a 5,000 sq ft one-story ranch instead of a 2,000 sq ft one-story ranch, there will be some economies of scale savings on bulk material purchases, mobilization/demobilization of construction crews, etc.  But essentially, the cost per sq ft is going to change a relatively negligible amount on a house that "sprawls" larger, but requires comparable materials and labor for the additional space.  The true opportunity for lowering the cost per sq ft by building larger is in using otherwise inexpensive wasted space.  This is what I imagine you are referring to.

Going from a house with an unfinished basement to a house with a finished basement will dramatically increase the finished/conditioned sq ft, while dramatically lowering the price per sq ft.  Same goes for finishing "bonus space" over a garage or in an attic.  The roof, the walls, and the floors were already mostly paid for.  Just finishing the space yields a major bonus in finished square footage at a modest added cost. 

The following home-cost.com explanation describes how dramatically finishing such spaces can shift price per sq ft. In this example, depending on how much of the available space is finished at the time of construction, the house can be built for a high price of $129 per sq ft, to a low of $80 per sq ft, with a "finished" sq footage difference from 3,000 sq ft to 5,346 sq ft, but in both cases a total constructed sq ft of 6,228.

I hope this helps.

regards,

Grant


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By Joe in Duluth, MN on 9/30/2009


How accurate is the home-cost.com web site? Does it account for GC costs?


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By Kenneth in Lees Summit, MO on 10/1/2009


The thing about square foot costs is that there are simply too many variables for them to be accurate. Let's use a 2,500 s.f. house, this could be 50x50 perimeter, for a total wall perimeter of 200 linear feet. This same s.f. could also be accomplished by a 2,500x1 perimeter for a total wall perimeter of 5,002 linear feet. Clearly one configuration is much more costly per s.f. than the other configuration. Granted, these are both extremes in the model, but then an s.f. cost model deals with neither. This is why s.f. pricing estimates fail.

I wouldn't automatically assume that ICF prices are price-premium to wood walls, especially if you desire to upgrade those walls with icynene or bio-based insulation. And being in Minnesota, ICF offers many benefits that will be extremely difficult (and costly) to obtain with wood walls. Granted the price point worked for me, it might not work in every situation, but make no assumptions and let the numbers come in. ICF is most certainly an upgrade in quality, the cost premium might not be what you expect. And since you already are planning an ICF sub on site, you have already absorbed the mob./demob. costs so the premium of having them do more work might be quite reasonable. For me, the cost premium was actually negative (ICF wall was cheaper that wood framing). As to three stories (two stories and basement), reinforced concrete can easily accomodate much more than this.


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By Belinda in Augusta, GA on 10/3/2009


Speaking of ICF costs vs wood framing costs, we were consulting with a builder trying to reduce our costs.  He suggested we do our basement with ICFs, but the main floor be done with 2x6 and closed-cell insulation to get the same effect of the ICFs but at a lower cost.  We wanted ICFs for the whole house. What is your opinion?

Belinda


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By Lori in Reno, NV on 10/3/2009


Joe,

We built in Reno, Nevada started in 2006 moved in 2007. Take a look at our journal, it's a little out of date: tooleshouse. It has some budgeting stuff in it. House size 2,508 sf finished single level with a 1,000 sf of unfinished attached under truss mother-in-law quarters We wanted to build for around $100/sf; we ended up spending $120. Total cost: $302,500 and it appraised for $199/sf. We hired out some of the big jobs that there was no way we could have done. For example, the footings and stem wall, electrical and plumbing. Except for the occasional laborers we did the rest with family and friends. I am a clearance shopper and used 10% HD and Lowe's coupons almost every time I shopped and I still cannot imagine building a house for $40/sf. That means I would've had to build my house for $100,320 and I spent that on: bringing power 1,000 feet to the house, septic, electrical, footings/stem wall, plumbing, sheetrock, insulation, and all the wood to build the house (excluding trusses). 

Our friends were building the same time we were and they did the ICF basement, stick second and third floor and they wish they would have just done ICF all the way up.

Get your blueprints drawn up and start planning. Good luck!


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By David in Greenville, SC on 10/3/2009


Hi Belinda,

Well,  you say you were working with a builder trying to reduce costs. So my first question would be how much did he say using his method versus all ICF would save? If the savings meant the different between being able to build the home versus not building, then I'd go for the 2x6 and foam. It's not exactly the same as the ICF because it doesn't give you the thermal mass of concrete. However, it would still be very efficient if done correctly. Not to mention quite comfortable. Now, if it's your heart's desire to use ICF and the savings are minor then just wait and save a little more cash to pay the difference.

Keep in mind, however, that while ICF's are great and they get a lot of press on this site, they are not by any means the only method of building a strong, quiet, efficient, and comfortable house. Moreover, they are rarely the most economical way of accomplishing any of the above. Something to think about if your budget is feeling pinched.


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By Belinda in Augusta, GA on 10/4/2009


David,

The builder made suggestions and we are going to sit down with him and go into detail over possible numbers.  My husband's heart is set on ICFs for a strong house, against tornadoes and for security measures.  You mentioned other methods that can be used to build a strong house, what are your ideas?


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By Mary in PA on 10/4/2009


David - like the previous post, I too would be interested in your comments. I know you can detail it all out here ... but a few ideas to point us in a new direction we can research - that would be great if you have the time.
Thanks,
Mary


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By David in Greenville, SC on 10/4/2009


Hi Belinda,

Well, if your husband's heart is set on ICF construction, then you should probably go that route if you can afford it. Otherwise you'll hear about it forever! Kidding! Actually, if absolute strength is the primary concern then reinforced concrete is about the best thing going. Which, of course, is what you get with ICF construction. However, I did a quick bit of research before responding as to the odds of being struck by a tornado. The information I found ranged from about three chances in a million to once about every 2,000 (yes - 2,000) years! Of course, my house could be destroyed tomorrow by one. But I wouldn't consider ICF construction solely for the purpose of withstanding a violent storm.

On the issue of security I couldn't find any stats about crooks coming in through the walls. I've heard of it happening, but doors and windows are still the name of the game for unlawful entry. Again, I wouldn't consider ICF's solely for security purposes. Now, these are just my thoughts and I certainly wouldn't criticize another's choice if it gave them peace of mind. It's your house and it's your money. Spend it accordingly! However, we all have to be careful from time to time that we aren't just rationalizing a want. ICF's are great, but not the only game in town. But, if you want them, use them.

Also, one of the things to consider even with ICF construction is that a storm can still tear off or send things crashing down on a roof. Which is why most experts in the storm shelter field still recommend an underground shelter. Or, lacking that, an above-ground shelter secured to the foundation with a reinforced concrete roof. And located away from the exterior walls.

As to strong alternatives: well, what your builder recommended for your main floors is a great place to start. I have seen tests (published in Fine Homebuilding magazine, if I remember correctly) that show closed-cell foam can actually increase a wall's impact resistance greatly. I won't say how much because I don't remember exactly, but it was significantly better than a typical sheathed and fiberglass insulated wall. Also, it provided increased resistance to lateral movement of the frame. Remember, however, that no matter the wall's resistance to impact. It won't prevent objects from coming through a window! Now, one of the best ways to prevent damage from a storm is to prevent uplift of both the frame from the foundation and the roof from the frame. Bolts actually set in the concrete of the foundation will hold the bottom plate against uplift. Concrete anchors fired in after the foundation is set will not always fare so well. Steel strapping or brackets around every few studs up from the bottom plate help resist the studs pulling away from the bottom plate. An engineer could determine the appropriate spacing of strapping for your area. So called "hurricane" clips help anchor the roof framing to the top plate of the wall. There are also products on the market called shear walls that include all of these features in an engineered panel.

Those are just a few methods of building a storm resistant or "strong" home. Brick veneer can also add a layer of impact resistance.  Of course, all of these techniques are more expensive than typical framing, but in the coastal areas where so much of that is now code, storm damage from tropical storms and hurricanes has been greatly reduced. Nothing is totally safe, however. If your stick-built or ICF home were hit directly by an EF5 tornado (you'd have a better chance of being struck by lightning twice and winning the lottery in the same year!) chances of your survival in any above-ground structure are slim.

However, the real question seems to be what will the builder's suggestions really save you. Without that knowledge you really can't move forward. Once you have that information, then it's up to you to decide what you need and want most. 2x6 walls and closed-cell foam with a bit of reinforcement will stand up to almost anything that Augusta, GA is likely to see. And if I were faced with something I didn't think it would survive then I don't think ICF would make me feel safer! Hope that helps a little.


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By David in Greenville, SC on 10/4/2009


Hi Mary,

I outlined several things in my response to Belinda that may be helpful to you. I actually think ICF's are great, but they are expensive as so many products at the high end of the market are. Unfortunately we all have to make choices as to how best to allocate our finances. And a typical family with two or three kids is almost always going to choose a bit more space or an extra bedroom or two versus high-end construction products. I don't blame them either! However, they shouldn't be led to believe they can't have a wonderful, comfortable, efficient, and livable home they can afford.

I know that's probably not what you were looking for, but if you'd like to share what kinds of "new directions" you were thinking about, maybe I can be more specific.


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By Mary in PA on 10/5/2009


David, thanks for taking the time to post such informative and thoughtful replies. Your two posts above were exactly the info I was looking for. Things for me to consider... as I churn ideas for the envelope. I was considering Durisol rather than ICF. If you do a search on Durisol on this site you'll come across another post where I put in some links to Durisol info. It appealed to the hubby on account of strength, security and fire resistance. It appealed to me for its reputed 'healthy indoors' aspects and potential for uninsulated interior thermal mass. And when I really, really think about it, I have to admit that my husband's 'strength and security' issues are just the flip side of my 'healthy and eco' desires - both perhaps more rooted in 'want' than 'need'. 

I got a price on the Durisol blocks (just the blocks delivered to the site, no concrete or labor) and it about blew my socks off! That's when reality started to set in and I said to myself, "Self - what are you really getting with Durisol that you're not going to get from a well-built 2x6? Especially when you consider that doors and windows really wreck the argument for security and fire protection." And Self had to admit that maybe bragging rights were part and parcel of wanting Durisol. If I won the lottery and cost were no object, well, then Durisol it would be. But I don't even buy tickets so I don't think wining anytime soon is likely.

Bottom line - I'm not certain yet, but leaning to a more conventional 2x6 construction. And your post has been a great help in hashing out some of the ideas. Thanks!


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By Rachal in Janesville, CA on 10/5/2009


Building my home was all about affordability.  When I received the takeoff (list and price for materials) for framing, I was sold.  It was right after the recession took hold and I ended up paying around $25,000 for 2x6 framing of a 2,000 sq ft home.  This did not include the trusses, but did include the sheathing for the roof.  I had talked to SIP companies prior to this and didn't like the sales tactics.  I could never get a simple answer and to use them I would have had to pay $3,000 in engineering fees for the state of California.  The other downfall was that I would have to hire a contractor for the job.  I ended up paying someone an hourly wage for the framing and saved thousands. 

Of course this has no impact on safety, etc., but if you're looking at different ways of performing this build, these may be things to consider.

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By Belinda in Augusta, GA on 10/5/2009


David,

I agree with Mary, thank you so much for your opinion and ideas.  I will look up the article in Fine Homebuilding so I will have the pros and cons of both building materials to consider.  But it will need to be a strong argument if it's not for the ICFs the hubby wants, or you are right, I will hear about it for a very long time!!

Belinda


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